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bator

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Reply with quote  #16 
dear azadi i agree that you should have the right to express your opinions of which a agree with some and disagree with others. you wrote a lot but still didnt answer my question: if gadaffi became a monarchist why didnt he restore the libyan kingdom? he should have brought back the legitime senussi royal house of libya, and not putting himself on that throne as an usurper. since he was made the first king of kings of africa he could have kept that title, though i dont like the thought of a rapist and abuser being king of kings. however at least he donated money for rebuilding a royal palace in uganda. in the kingdom of tooro. but being so evil and with so low moral disgusts me.
azadi

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Reply with quote  #17 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bator
dear azadi i agree that you should have the right to express your opinions of which a agree with some and disagree with others. you wrote a lot but still didnt answer my question: if gadaffi became a monarchist why didnt he restore the libyan kingdom? he should have brought back the legitime senussi royal house of libya, and not putting himself on that throne as an usurper. since he was made the first king of kings of africa he could have kept that title, though i dont like the thought of a rapist and abuser being king of kings. however at least he donated money for rebuilding a royal palace in uganda. in the kingdom of tooro. but being so evil and with so low moral disgusts me.

Gaddafi not restoring the Senussi monarchy of Libya is hardly surprising, because he wanted to be the head of state of Libya himself. I consider Gaddafi a monarchist, because he supported the traditional monarchies. Reza Shah Pahlavi was elected Shah of Iran after deposing the last Kadjar Shah of Iran. I consider the Senussi royal house of Libya extinct, because Idris, the only Senussi King of Libya, died childless. The present-day Senussis aren't descendants of a former King of Libya. You must be a descendant of a former king of your country in order to be a legitimate claimant to the throne. Gaddafi became the legitimate head of state of Libya, when King Idris of Libya died in 1983. I'm a Bonapartist, but I support the claim of the Orleans dynasty to the throne of France, because I consider the Imperial House of Bonaparte extinct due to neither Napoleon nor Napoleon III having any living legitimate descendants. I prefer the Orleans claimant to the French throne to the Legitimist claimant to the French throne, because I dislike French Legitimism. I support the legacy of the French Revolution of 1789, while rejecting the legacy of the French Revolution of 1792.
Saif al-Islam Gaddafi, the son of Gaddafi, wants to become President of Libya. I will endorse Saif al-Islam Gaddafi in the upcoming presidential election in Libya.
Wessexman

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Reply with quote  #18 
What you keep ignoring, amongst other things, is Gaddafi was a comic villain, and his son isn't much better. Hardly a great representative for monarchism. All in all, his son should have got a short drop and sudden stop. I endorse the Libyan state rectifying that oversight.
azadi

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Originally Posted by Wessexman
What you keep ignoring, amongst other things, is Gaddafi was a comic villain, and his son isn't much better. Hardly a great representative for monarchism. All in all, his son should have got a short drop and sudden stop. I endorse the Libyan state rectifying that oversight.

The US invasion of Libya was unacceptable. Invading another country for the purpose of changing its form of government is wrong. I supported the US invasion of Iraq, because Saddam committed genocide against the Kurds, and I supported the US invasion of Afghanistan, because the Taliban sheltered Osama bin Laden, but Gaddafi has never committed genocide, and Gaddafi ceased to support international terrorism long before the US invasion of Libya.
Wessexman

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Reply with quote  #20 
This isn't about the invasion. Gaddafi had a sex dungeon for heck's sake. He ruled with an iron fist and was a major supporter of international terrorism. He was a comic book villain and deserved what he got. It's a shame his son escaped a similar fate. I think it is probably better Assad keeps control of Syria, for the sake of stability in the country and region, given the other options. He's still a brutal dictator. The two things can be true at once.
azadi

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wessexman
This isn't about the invasion. Gaddafi had a sex dungeon for heck's sake. He ruled with an iron fist and was a major supporter of international terrorism. He was a comic book villain and deserved what he got. It's a shame his son escaped a similar fate. I think it is probably better Assad keeps control of Syria, for the sake of stability in the country and region, given the other options. He's still a brutal dictator. The two things can be true at once.

Gaddafi ceased to support international terrorism long before the US invasion of Libya.
Wessexman

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Reply with quote  #22 
Yes, because he got spooked by the invasion of Iraq. So what?
azadi

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Reply with quote  #23 
My list of legitimate rulers of Libya:
Idris as-Senussi, King of Libya: December 24 1951-May 25 1983
Muammar Gaddafi, Brotherly Leader of Libya: May 25 1983-October 20 2011. Was King of Kings of Africa from August 28 2008 to October 20 2011.
Saif al-Islam Gaddafi, the son and designated successor of Muammar Gaddafi: Since October 20 2011
Wessexman

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Reply with quote  #24 
If Saif is unavailable, I suppose the Yorkshire ripper is still alive.
Ethiomonarchist

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Reply with quote  #25 
The idea is completely absurd.  Africa has native monarchies that should be cultivated.  We don't need some upstart usurper heir to a psychotic butcher being set up over the entire continent.  Why don't you suggest an heir of Saddam Hussein to rule over all of Asia?  Or a son of Erik Honneker was Emperor over Europe?  It's just offensive.
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The Lion of Judah hath prevailed.

Ethiopia stretches her hands unto God (Quote from Psalm 68 which served as the Imperial Motto of the Ethiopian Empire)

"God and history shall remember your judgment." (Quote from Emperor Haile Selassie I's speech to the League of Nations to plead for assistance against the Italian Invasion, 1936.)
azadi

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Reply with quote  #26 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ethiomonarchist
The idea is completely absurd.  Africa has native monarchies that should be cultivated.  We don't need some upstart usurper heir to a psychotic butcher being set up over the entire continent.  Why don't you suggest an heir of Saddam Hussein to rule over all of Asia?  Or a son of Erik Honneker was Emperor over Europe?  It's just offensive.

Saddam and Erich Honecker have done immense harm to my countries. Have Gaddafi done any harm to your country?
Gaddafi actually supported the native monarchies of Africa, and Gaddafi was elected King of Kings of Africa by 200 native African kings. Do you consider the election of Gaddafi as King of Kings of Africa to be illegitimate?
Gaddafi supported the establishment of an upper house of a Pan-African parliament, whose members shall be native African kings. Do you support this proposal?
Do you support Pan-Africanism? I support Pan-Iranism and European integration. I would like Reza Pahlavi to be Shah of a Kingdom of Greater Iran, and I would like King Felipe of Spain to be Emperor of the United States of Europe. 
Wessexman

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Reply with quote  #27 
To be fair, Saddam's son can't be the rightful ruler of Kurdistan, as that is obviously Ed Davis, governor of Gibraltar (representative of her majesty).
bator

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Reply with quote  #28 
Quote:
Originally Posted by azadi

Gaddafi not restoring the Senussi monarchy of Libya is hardly surprising, because he wanted to be the head of state of Libya himself. I consider Gaddafi a monarchist, because he supported the traditional monarchies. Reza Shah Pahlavi was elected Shah of Iran after deposing the last Kadjar Shah of Iran. I consider the Senussi royal house of Libya extinct, because Idris, the only Senussi King of Libya, died childless. The present-day Senussis aren't descendants of a former King of Libya. You must be a descendant of a former king of your country in order to be a legitimate claimant to the throne. Gaddafi became the legitimate head of state of Libya, when King Idris of Libya died in 1983.


a real monarchist would value restorig the monarchy higher than remaining in power himself. 

this rule about having to be a descendent of a former king, where is this written? can you tell me a paragraph in the rules of succesion stating that? or is it just your opinion?
azadi

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Reply with quote  #29 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bator


a real monarchist would value restorig the monarchy higher than remaining in power himself. 

this rule about having to be a descendent of a former king, where is this written? can you tell me a paragraph in the rules of succesion stating that? or is it just your opinion?

The rule about having to be a descendant of a former king is my personal opinion. That's why I support the Orleans claim to the French throne, despite being a Bonapartist. If the present-day Bonapartes had been descendants of Napoleon, I would have supported a Bonaparte restoration in France. I agree, that Gaddafi made a mistake by not crowning himself King of Libya. I prefer restoration of ancient dynasties to establishing new monarchies from scratch, but I'm not opposed to usurpers. I admire Napoleon and the Pahlavis, and I definitely prefer Zog to Wilhelm of Wied.

Ethiomonarchist

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Reply with quote  #30 
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Saddam and Erich Honecker have done immense harm to my countries. Have Gaddafi done any harm to your country?


Gaddafi has done emense harm to my country.  He poured money and weapons into the Derg regime which butchered my people, and then when he fell out with them poured money into various separatist groups and Islamic fundamentalist groups.  He was a truly evil man who has the blood of thousands on his hands.  May he burn for eternity.

__________________
The Lion of Judah hath prevailed.

Ethiopia stretches her hands unto God (Quote from Psalm 68 which served as the Imperial Motto of the Ethiopian Empire)

"God and history shall remember your judgment." (Quote from Emperor Haile Selassie I's speech to the League of Nations to plead for assistance against the Italian Invasion, 1936.)
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