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BaronVonServers

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Reply with quote  #31 
Uh, the subjects don't generally get to determine who is the more 'qualifying heir' (except perhaps when the monarch abdicates without naming an heir or regent, and some 'conqueror hero' comes in and gets the other 'estates' to approve the conquest.....), at least not without the reigning monarch's consent.....



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Ethiomonarchist

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Reply with quote  #32 
That's not a topic that I'd want to touch with a ten foot pole right now, however to provide some background, it is to be noted that His Imperial Highness Prince Ermias recognizes his cousin Prince Zera Yacob as head of the Imperial House, and Prince Zera Yacob recognizes Prince Ermias as the President of the Crown Council. 

There have been questions about the Crown Prince's health, and his lack of a male heir (Princess Lideta is his only issue).  Prince Ermias has twin sons, Princess Sahle Selassie (nick named Christian) and Prince Fisseha Tsion (nick named Rufael)  However, according to the established order of succession, the Duke of Harrar, his brothers and nephews all come before Prince Ermias and his sons.  Additionally there are those who believe that the Emperor in Exile Amha Selassie's appointment of his grandson Prince Bekere Fikre Selassie as "Enderase" (Vice Roy or Regent depending on your interpretation) meant that he wanted him to be next in line after Prince Zera Yacob.  However Prince Bekere is a female line decendent of the Emperor in Exile (his mother the late Princess Ijigayehu was the daughter of the Emperor in Exile by his first marriage) while the other Princes are all male line heirs of Emperor Haile Selassie.  Prince Bekere Fikre Selassie however, unlike the male line heirs, can claim royal decent from the Tigrean branch of the Imperial family on his maternal grandmother's side.  He can also claim Oromo royal blood from the former ruling family of Naqa Lekemt on his father's side.  Prince Ermias can claim Naqa Lekemt royal blood on his mother's side as well.  Links to these ethnic groups can have some considerable bearing in the new ethnicised politics of Ethiopia, where the Imperial family have inaccurately been branded as ethnically Amhara.  They are in fact multi-ethnic thanks to constant intermarriage with the nobility of other ethnic groups.

I don't think the monarchist cause would be served by deviding it between rival contenders.

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The Lion of Judah hath prevailed.

Ethiopia stretches her hands unto God (Quote from Psalm 68 which served as the Imperial Motto of the Ethiopian Empire)

"God and history shall remember your judgment." (Quote from Emperor Haile Selassie I's speech to the League of Nations to plead for assistance against the Italian Invasion, 1936.)
KYMonarchist

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Reply with quote  #33 

Long live Emperor Zara Yaqub II of Ethiopia!!!!!! Kill Dergist mo'fo's!!!!!!!!!!!


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panafricanforum

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Reply with quote  #34 

It is not to start rival between the imperial house.  I feel prince Ermias would be a better candidate for the throne.  He have shown talent and understanding of the political times we leave in basically he could lead the imperial house to the modern age.

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royalcello

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Reply with quote  #35 
Quote:
Originally Posted by panafricanforum
I feel prince Ermias would be a better candidate for the throne. 


You're just like RoyalistCavalier, saying that he "feels" that an obscure grandnephew of Nicholas II should be considered the claimant to the Russian throne instead of Maria Vladimirovna.  An individual monarchist should not be so concerned with his own personal "feelings" but rather with who is the rightful heir to the throne according to the laws that were in place before the monarchy fell.
Peter

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Reply with quote  #36 
I agree of course, but as I understand it Ethiopia does not have a rigid primogeniture system. Haile Selassie I himself would not have been by Western understanding the most senior heir, though he was undoubted Emperor. Constitutionally, the Emperor must now be from his line, but otherwise the succession essentially proceeds by nomination. As Crown Prince Amha Selassie I succeeded de jure, and named his son Zere Yakob as his own Crown Prince, which title he has retained since his father's death, and named no successor.

So it must be legitimate to speculate on the succession at least to Zere Yakob, though it's probably a rather sensitive issue. If I have these things right; I am sure Ethiomonarchist or someone will correct me if not.
Ethiomonarchist

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Reply with quote  #37 
Peter is exactly right.  Many Emperors were not the eldest sons of their predicessor, indeed often they were brothers or cousins.  The old rules of succession state simply that the male line of descent from King Solomon and the Queen of Sheba is the prefered line of succession.  Upon the death of the monarch, often times the nobility would choose a new Emperor of their liking from the male members of the Imperial family who were all imprisoned in a mountain fortress (the fortress of Debre Wehni or the monasteries of Gishen Mariam or Debre Damo) Following the userpation of Tewodros II (who deposed the hapless Yohannis III in 1856) the succession hasn't even adhered to the male line of the dynasty.  Both the briefly reigning Tekle Giorgis II and the longer reigning Yohannis IV were in the female line of decent. Menelik II was of uninterrupted direct male line descent, and his accession was regarded as a restoration of the true and correct line.  However, his only son predeceased him as a child.  One daughter produced his designated heir Lij Eyasu, and the other daughter eventually succeeded as Empress Zewditu.  Zewditu was succeeded by her cousin Haile Selassie whose paternal grandmother was Menelik II's aunt.  Thus the rival lines of Lij Eyasu and Haile Selassie are both in the female line.  The senior cadet lines (those of the Tigrean descendants of Yohannis IV, and the Selalle line of Ras Kassa, and the line of King Tekle Haimanot of Gojjam) are all descended from the dynasty through female links.  There are male line descendants however who survive.  Menelik II's uncle, Merid Azmatch Haile Mikael had a son, Dejazmatch Gulilat, who in turn had a son, Dejazmatch Taye.  Due to Merid Azmatch Haile Mikael's rebellion against his nephew Menelik, the Emperor deeply disliked these relatives and kept them under watch.  Although according to the old rules, Dejazmatch Taye Gulilat should have been named Menelik's heir (he was after all the closest heir in the male line), Menelik refused to do so, and named Lij Eyasu instead.  The nobility out of thier loyalty to Menelik II chose to support Empress Zewditu and Ras Taffari (Emperor Haile Selassie) instead of Dejazmatch Taye when Lij Eyasu was excommunicated and deposed in 1917.  Today there is a grandson of Dejazmatch Taye living in Canada.  However he makes no claim on the Imperial throne and lives very quietly and removed from all such activity.

It is best to stick with the rules of succession that were set forth in the revised constitution of 1955 limiting it to the descendants of Emperor Haile Selassie, with preference over the male lines over the female lines.

Here is a link to a wikipedia page which lists the current order of succession in compliance with the 1955 rules.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line_of_succession_to_the_Ethiopian_Throne

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The Lion of Judah hath prevailed.

Ethiopia stretches her hands unto God (Quote from Psalm 68 which served as the Imperial Motto of the Ethiopian Empire)

"God and history shall remember your judgment." (Quote from Emperor Haile Selassie I's speech to the League of Nations to plead for assistance against the Italian Invasion, 1936.)
panafricanforum

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Reply with quote  #38 

I agree with you the succession of throne should go by the 1955 consitution.  But the Imperial house must act now if they want to restore the monarchy.  Yes there is a government in Ethiopia that distance themselves from the Imperial house.  But the imperial house must begin the process in moving towards friendship to the government.  I am sure there are those in the government who are friendly to the imperial house.   The imperial house must move in simular fashion as did the King of Spain did when he restored the monarchy.  You can not call yourself and monarchy if you are not willing to restore it's institution. 

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royalcello

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Reply with quote  #39 
I agree, but I'm not sure the parallel with Spain can be much help.  Spain had a monarchy-friendly right-wing dictator who had come to power in a counterrevolution against the left-wing republic that had overthrown the monarchy.  Ethiopia has not had anything like that.
TheRoyalist

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Reply with quote  #40 


Quote:
Originally Posted by royalcello
counterrevolution


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Reply with quote  #41 

Royalcello I do understand what your talking about but I am not trying to compare the situation in Spain to Ethiopia.  One thing the Ethiopian monarchy can learn from the restoration of the Spainish monarchy is that King Juan Carlos I did not sit and wait and hope the monarchy would return.   If you have read anything on the King you know he did things in the background to help restore the monarchy in Spain.   What I am trying to get at is that the Ethiopian imperial can't sit in the background and hope the monarchy return they have to get up and do their duty in restoring the monarchy.

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Reply with quote  #42 

Nice picture, was that HIH's desk? I would've enjoyed meeting him, he was courageous.

Ethiomonarchist

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Reply with quote  #43 
Blayne,
Yes that is His Imperial Majesty's desk at the Jubilee Palace (now called the National Palace) in Addis Ababa.

The current ruling party in Ethiopia is hostile to the idea of monarchy.  Although they have recognized the rights of the members of the Imperial family to royal titles, they are otherwise completely opposed to a restoration and leave no doubt about this.  It is unlikely that any attempts to win them over would bear any fruit.  I think such a thing is not possible as long as the EPRDF remains in power.

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The Lion of Judah hath prevailed.

Ethiopia stretches her hands unto God (Quote from Psalm 68 which served as the Imperial Motto of the Ethiopian Empire)

"God and history shall remember your judgment." (Quote from Emperor Haile Selassie I's speech to the League of Nations to plead for assistance against the Italian Invasion, 1936.)
panafricanforum

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Reply with quote  #44 

Ethiomonarchist I understand what you are saying but the imperial family must fine another way in communicating with certain members of the government.  The imperial family must begin the process of educating the populace why the monarchy should be restored.  The current heir to the throne must restore the monarchy it is his duty to do so.  A movement in the U.S. can help in  the process.  Is the military leadership in Ethiopia friendly towards the monarchy?

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I am for the restoration of the Ethiopian monarchy.

Pragmatist

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Reply with quote  #45 
NO!

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