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DavidV

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http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-12-12/malcolm-turnbull-gives-keynote-address-at-republican-dinner/8112058

I admitted that I had tried to be fair to Turnbull in the past, assuming he wouldn't dare touch the issue. Now we see it. And I miss Tony Abbott, who I believe was hounded out by a carefully orchestrated campaign by Left and minority interests who were funded from abroad. It's clear subsequent events (Trump, Brexit) have vindicated by defence of Abbott.
AugieDoggie

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Reply with quote  #2 
Shameful, but not surprising. Can we really trust republicans, "former" or active, in the Commonwealth to *not* bring up the issue at some point once they're in a high position? Even the former Governor-General Quentin Bryce came out as one of them towards the end of her time.
DavidV

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Reply with quote  #3 
Malcolm Turnbull and Justin Trudeau are looking like big bad jokes. Both of them are, with a touch of irony, "behind the times". They represent the type of mushy liberalism that has been rejected by the electorate in the US, UK, Hungary, Poland and elsewhere. And maybe France and Italy too.
Queenslander

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Reply with quote  #4 
"Yesterday's Heroes" as Vanda and Young put it in the 1970s, although those pair would have made for seemingly 'perfect' 1990s leaders.

I just hope we are rid of the Aussie imposter by the 20th of next month too, and that is looking likelier with each and every day.

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ROO86

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Reply with quote  #5 
It just goes to show how self absorbed he is. Why would any astute politician, with popularity as low as Traitor Turnbull's, touch this massively divisive issue? It's one thing to know he's a republican, it's another thing for him to push it in your face and all he will achieve from this is to further anger the base of the Liberal Party.

Having said that, he probably still thinks he's the messiah and the most popular PM in history
DavidV

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Reply with quote  #6 
That's just it. I believed he would not dare do so for fear of a voter and party backlash, but he's just done that and the gloves are off.
Peter

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Reply with quote  #7 
Having read the article, I note that Mr Turnbull has not yet given his address. While I agree that his attending the event does not bode well, why not wait and see what he says? Also, while republicans are happily a minority strand in Australia at present, they are still a significantly large strand and it doesn't seem unreasonable to me for a politician to engage with them, though in what exact way he does this is another question. On a related matter, I also read this linked article, which seemed quite a fair appraisal of monarchy today to me. I just hope that the ominous remark at the end does not seem all too relevant this time next year.
DavidV

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Reply with quote  #8 
On the radio today, the AML's Philip Benwell:
http://www.2gb.com/audioplayer/225051#WT2KGbxQQqXogKJW.99http://ow.ly/JtqE3074JBA
Wessexman

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Reply with quote  #9 
Maybe I'm pessimistic, but I'm not sure republicans are a minority in Australia. It would be hard to gauge the beliefs of the public. Most are, I suspect, indifferent either way. The media seems to be almost universally republican, which can mislead one into thinking the public is of the same opinion even when they're not. I much more rarely encounter monarchist sentiment amongst the public at large, either in real life or online, than I do republican. I doubt there will be much movement in the near future, as political leaders seem distracted, but it is ominous that we have a leader like Turnbull, and I fear what could happen should there be a more concerted push by politicians. I'd be interested to know what non-Anglo-Australians think on the issue. They can be a powerful force for social and cultural conservatism, even if multiculturalism is often used as an excuse to undermine just these causes. If they are won to the monarchy, then it will be a lot safer, if they consider it as British and irrelevant to the Australia they emigrated to, then it will be in trouble.

DavidV

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Reply with quote  #10 
"A powerful force for social and cultural conservatism"? Actually, as I see it the non-Anglo minorities are being whipped into victimhood and Anglo-bashing by a Leftist media and academic class. It's European immigrants and their offspring who are more likely to be a vanguard against the Cultural Marxist agenda in this country. There is no "enrichment" of Australian culture by multiculturalism despite what the Left says. The academic elites in this country bash its British heritage, even if many of them are middle-class Anglos. It is also clear that, as in Britain, you find ethnic minority people who harbour resentment for the very British values and institutions of this country because of their alleged historic "victim" status.

Many older (mostly European) immigrants in this country are a bulwark of its values and civilisation. But I've been burned by the fact that many more recent, especially non-European, immigrants have no sense of loyalty or appreciation to this country and a sense of victimhood and entitlement, which no doubt the ALP, Greens, ABC, et al encourages. Same with the indigenous industry in this country. It is time we rally behind defending our people and civilisation, or not at all.

So I don't know where you got your idea that these immigrants somehow are a force for conservatism (when examples elsewhere shows they are not), unless you got some very strange idea in your head, probably from whatever latest spiritual fad or fancy idea you've embraced. Ommmmmmm....
Wessexman

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Reply with quote  #11 
I agree. As I said, multiculturalism is often used as an excuse to undermine traditional values. But these ethnic and cultural groups are often more socially and culturally conservative than the white majority, in both Britain and Australia. So it doesn't all go one way.
DavidV

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Reply with quote  #12 
Which ethnic and cultural groups specifically? Eastern European and Balkan immigrants have generally been successful in this country. I know of Iranian immigrants who for obvious reasons are also very grateful to this country.

However, in both Britain and Australia many immigrant groups are encouraged to resent the country's "colonial" history, symbols, institutions and whatnot, and serve little more than vote banks for Labour and the ALP (also because they will vote for whoever entrenches the welfare state). It's tribalist identity politics in essence.

The fact is that the Left doesn't care about immigrants or their culture or religion. They are simply using them and inventing their identity politics and victim culture purely for their goal of revolution by insidious means. That also means undermining our flag, symbols, traditions and the Crown.
Wessexman

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Reply with quote  #13 
Just about all of them - Eastern Europeans, Southern Europeans, Near Easterners, and Far Easterners are in various ways, on average, more socially conservative than the average white Brit or Aussie. I have read, for example, that Tony Abbott was actually more popular in Western Sydney, and may have done better in this year's election, than Turnbull, because these areas, often with high ethnic populations, are less socially liberal, and less interested in social liberal causes, than the east of the city (where the media class lives). If you are talking at a wider cultural level - a commitment to the historical identity and cultural of Britain or Australia - I agree that this is not necessarily strong amongst these groups. Their social conservatism, such as it is, is largely expressed within their own culture, and loyalty to it and its values. Whether it is possible to turn their social conservatism into this kind of cultural conservatism, one with loyalty to the monarchy and British heritage , I'm not sure. 

 It is more the so called community leaders, usually, who embrace the resentment of British and Australia heritage. It is these people who have imbibed cultural Marxism. Most members of the community are more likely to be indifferent (with the possible exception of Muslims and, in Britain, blacks). Most Chinese or Vietnamese Australians, for example, don't hate Australia's British and pre-multicultural heritage, but they may not feel much of an attachment to it. Whether it is possible to create such an attachment, and how, I don't know.
DavidV

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Reply with quote  #14 
It is true that the suburban and countryside people - regardless of their background - are more likely to be socially conservative. You also have members of various churches in Sydney suburbs who also tend to vote Liberal or for the CDP or Family First. It is not simply an Anglo vs non-Anglo thing. However, the ALP and Greens do try and harvest votes among minorities based on identity politics, similar to what Labour and Democrats do in the UK and US.

You seem to think we monarchists need to embrace people based on your own traditionalist/Platonic/Perennialist pretentious nonsense. It's clear to me that you, being an some sort intellectual or academic, don't really live in the real world like most of us do. Just like this article says. Ommmmmm....
Wessexman

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Reply with quote  #15 
Can you please explain to me where what I wrote here has anything to do with that "traditionalist/Platonic/Perennialist pretentious nonsense"?

Again you descend into crude, personal attacks. And this time I can't even fathom a scintilla of a reason (not that there ever much of one), as I neither originally directly replied to you, nor strongly criticised your replies to me.

It seems like you have latched onto what I once mentioned, as something you don't understand but don't much like, and seem to wish to bring it up as often as you can, even when it has not the slightest thing to do with the topic at hand or what I wrote on it. My comments were precisely an appraisal of the real-world situation regarding Australia's ethnic population, at least in my judgment. This all doesn't say much either for your reading or thinking skills. It just makes it look like you are burning with resentment, or just unhinged. If you can't be civil, then don't reply, instead of dragging the board down with your own grudges.

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