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Ethiomonarchist

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A man in Colorado, Allan V. Evans, has claimed that he is the rightful King of the United Kingdom, and has placed a notice in British papers that he will claim the throne in 30 days (although he also states that he will not assume the throne until after the death of Elizabeth II whom he respects). I'm sure the Prince of Wales is very concerned. 

https://www.yahoo.com/news/american-man-politely-informs-brits-211144848.html

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The Lion of Judah hath prevailed.

Ethiopia stretches her hands unto God (Quote from Psalm 68 which served as the Imperial Motto of the Ethiopian Empire)

"God and history shall remember your judgment." (Quote from Emperor Haile Selassie I's speech to the League of Nations to plead for assistance against the Italian Invasion, 1936.)
jovan66102

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[rofl] As my Daddy used to say, with a shake of his head, 'It takes all kinds!'
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'Monarchy can easily be ‘debunked;' but watch the faces, mark the accents of the debunkers. These are the men whose tap-root in Eden has been cut: whom no rumour of the polyphony, the dance, can reach - men to whom pebbles laid in a row are more beautiful than an arch. Yet even if they desire equality, they cannot reach it. Where men are forbidden to honour a king they honour millionaires, athletes or film-stars instead: even famous prostitutes or gangsters. For spiritual nature, like bodily nature, will be served; deny it food and it will gobble poison.' C.S. Lewis God save Her Majesty Elizabeth the Second, by the Grace of God of the United Kingdom, Canada and Her other Realms and Territories Queen, Head of the Commonwealth, Defender of the Faith, etc.! Vive le Très haut, très puissant et très excellent Prince, Louis XX, Par la grâce de Dieu, Roi de France et de Navarre, Roi Très-chrétien!
Peter

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Reply with quote  #3 
There ain't no such thing as a documented and verified descent back to the third century for people of European origin. And I'm a bit sceptical about claims made for non-European lines, though I don't know enough about them to be sure. That aside, while this is mainly amusing there was a time when accepting the advertisement would have been seen as treasonous. Technically it still might be in law, though the possibility of a successful prosecution would be nil due to freedom of expression rights. I'm all for freedom of expression, but would have been even more for a newspaper saying 'No, this is traitorous, we're not having it. Even if it is all just a big joke, there are some things you don't joke about.'
jovan66102

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter
There ain't no such thing as a documented and verified descent back to the third century for people of European origin.

I MIGHT accept a Welsh lineage, preserved orally, but, of course, that would not lead to a claim to the Throne.

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 That aside, while this is mainly amusing there was a time when accepting the advertisement would have been seen as treasonous. Technically it still might be in law, though the possibility of a successful prosecution would be nil due to freedom of expression rights. I'm all for freedom of expression, but would have been even more for a newspaper saying 'No, this is traitorous, we're not having it. Even if it is all just a big joke, there are some things you don't joke about.'

Here, I totally agree with you!

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'Monarchy can easily be ‘debunked;' but watch the faces, mark the accents of the debunkers. These are the men whose tap-root in Eden has been cut: whom no rumour of the polyphony, the dance, can reach - men to whom pebbles laid in a row are more beautiful than an arch. Yet even if they desire equality, they cannot reach it. Where men are forbidden to honour a king they honour millionaires, athletes or film-stars instead: even famous prostitutes or gangsters. For spiritual nature, like bodily nature, will be served; deny it food and it will gobble poison.' C.S. Lewis God save Her Majesty Elizabeth the Second, by the Grace of God of the United Kingdom, Canada and Her other Realms and Territories Queen, Head of the Commonwealth, Defender of the Faith, etc.! Vive le Très haut, très puissant et très excellent Prince, Louis XX, Par la grâce de Dieu, Roi de France et de Navarre, Roi Très-chrétien!
Ethiomonarchist

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Well both of you will be sorry when King Allan I assumes his rightful throne and "Lady Britania [sic] who has contributed so much to the culture and history of the world shall be renewed and made great once again".    You will hang your heads in shame as " the light of freedom and egalitarianism shall be promoted and promulgated".

[rofl][rofl][rofl][rofl][rofl][rofl][rofl][rofl][rofl]

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The Lion of Judah hath prevailed.

Ethiopia stretches her hands unto God (Quote from Psalm 68 which served as the Imperial Motto of the Ethiopian Empire)

"God and history shall remember your judgment." (Quote from Emperor Haile Selassie I's speech to the League of Nations to plead for assistance against the Italian Invasion, 1936.)
Peter

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Reply with quote  #6 
It would just be King Allan, no numeral until there was an Allan II, like it's Queen Victoria not Queen Victoria I. I will though be duly apologetic when these joyful events take place. But if you don't mind I won't hold my breath waiting, could get a bit uncomfortable.
bator

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Reply with quote  #7 
i presume technically a monarch could choose to call himself I of that name, as did czar paul I even though there still havent been any paul II. hopefully there will be in the future
jovan66102

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Reply with quote  #8 
In Britain, Peter has a point, but Popes John Paul I and Francis I come to mind. Seems a bit presumptuous to me, like assuming your reign will cause a successor to take your regnal name!
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'Monarchy can easily be ‘debunked;' but watch the faces, mark the accents of the debunkers. These are the men whose tap-root in Eden has been cut: whom no rumour of the polyphony, the dance, can reach - men to whom pebbles laid in a row are more beautiful than an arch. Yet even if they desire equality, they cannot reach it. Where men are forbidden to honour a king they honour millionaires, athletes or film-stars instead: even famous prostitutes or gangsters. For spiritual nature, like bodily nature, will be served; deny it food and it will gobble poison.' C.S. Lewis God save Her Majesty Elizabeth the Second, by the Grace of God of the United Kingdom, Canada and Her other Realms and Territories Queen, Head of the Commonwealth, Defender of the Faith, etc.! Vive le Très haut, très puissant et très excellent Prince, Louis XX, Par la grâce de Dieu, Roi de France et de Navarre, Roi Très-chrétien!
Peter

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Reply with quote  #9 
It varies country by country, in Spain for example a sole bearer of the name still gets a numeral. In Britain it is a matter of custom and precedent, not law, and as bator says if a monarch chose to be known as so-and-so I that would be at his or her discretion. But none yet have. See this link, giving the texts of accession proclamations from Edward VI on, including seven who are or were during their reigns sole examples of their name.

These are Mary I of England, Elizabeth I of the same, James I of England who was also James VI of Scotland, Charles I, Anne, George I and Victoria. If you look at their proclamations and those of their successors you will see that no numeral is used for them in either case, even with George II who immediately followed George I; he is referred to as George II but his father just as King George. There is one exception, James I/VI. I suppose that as the proclamation refers to him first as James VI it was natural to continue by naming him as James I of his new kingdoms. However no numeral is used for either monarch in his son Charles I's proclamation.
royalcello

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Reply with quote  #10 
Franz Joseph of Austria-Hungary is often known as Franz Joseph I. For some monarchs it just seems right and for others it doesn't. (Extremely technical rule there.)
bator

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Reply with quote  #11 
in my opinion the advantage by calling the first of the number the first even in the persons own lifetime is, that then it looks better when the royal or imperial monogram contains I  the former spanish king was also juan carlos I and his monogram jc I and paul I p I
Peter

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Reply with quote  #12 
Although the elements available obviously make a difference, I would say design is the most important factor. Responding to royalcello, my feeling is that it looks right when it's customary, and not when it's not. Even where usage is not particularly systematic; the Empress Elizabeth of Russia for example never seems to be referred to as Elizabeth I and it would look odd if she were, and nor is her cousin and predecessor but one Anna usually spoken of as Anna I, but Elizabeth's great-nephew and eventual successor Paul I is almost always called that, and just Emperor Paul again would seem a little peculiar.

In the specific case of Austria, without actually knowing I would speculate that since the first Emperor of Austria Franz I was also the last Holy Roman Emperor as Franz II, a numeral was used for both as a way to distinguish between the roles (sole example Holy Roman Emperors did not customarily use a numeral, or have one retrospectively applied unless they ceased to be sole examples), and then people just carried on doing it for his successors.

Besides, the four Austrian Emperors Franz I, Ferdinand I, Franz Joseph I and Karl I were also Apostolic Kings of Hungary as respectively Ferenc (a sole example so no numeral was evidently the Hungarian custom for these, though see the next parenthesis), V. Ferdinánd, I. Ferenc József (ah, inconsistency, the spice of life; these titles are copied from the Hungarian Wikipedia so presumably reflect native usage) and IV. Károly. Although the establishment of the Dual Monarchy postdated the proclamation of the Austrian Empire by over six decades, this might also have been a factor encouraging the use of I.
Peter

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Reply with quote  #13 
As an afterthought, we had an extensive discussion of regnal names and numbering here. Anyone who has been interested by this thread (the number of which people is probably more than one but not exactly Reussian) and hadn't seen that might like to take a look at it.
Elizabelo_II

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Reply with quote  #14 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ethiomonarchist
Well both of you will be sorry when King Allan I assumes his rightful throne and "Lady Britania [sic] who has contributed so much to the culture and history of the world shall be renewed and made great once again".    You will hang your heads in shame as " the light of freedom and egalitarianism shall be promoted and promulgated".

[rofl][rofl][rofl][rofl][rofl][rofl][rofl][rofl][rofl]


And it will be glorious !
jovan66102

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Reply with quote  #15 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter
 more than one but not exactly Reussian)
[rofl]

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'Monarchy can easily be ‘debunked;' but watch the faces, mark the accents of the debunkers. These are the men whose tap-root in Eden has been cut: whom no rumour of the polyphony, the dance, can reach - men to whom pebbles laid in a row are more beautiful than an arch. Yet even if they desire equality, they cannot reach it. Where men are forbidden to honour a king they honour millionaires, athletes or film-stars instead: even famous prostitutes or gangsters. For spiritual nature, like bodily nature, will be served; deny it food and it will gobble poison.' C.S. Lewis God save Her Majesty Elizabeth the Second, by the Grace of God of the United Kingdom, Canada and Her other Realms and Territories Queen, Head of the Commonwealth, Defender of the Faith, etc.! Vive le Très haut, très puissant et très excellent Prince, Louis XX, Par la grâce de Dieu, Roi de France et de Navarre, Roi Très-chrétien!
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